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<p class="MsoNormal">By the way, most of these microelectrode-based studies, starting with Horace Barlow, are single cell studies. And the single cell studies are the ones that have won Noble prizes because of the insights they produced. The overall evidence
from these studies is not just about grandmother cells, but about single cells encoding abstractions and “meaning.” Reddy and Thorpe (2014) conclude:
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">“<i><span style="background:yellow;mso-highlight:yellow">In conclusion, evidence is accumulating that “concept cells” carry
<b>high-level, abstract stimulus information</b></span></i>.”<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Single cells having “meaning” was (and still is) at the heart of discussion at that time because it contradicts the fundamental population coding idea where single neurons by themselves have no meaning, they only have meaning collectively.
And Walter Freeman at that time could not accept the idea that single cells have meaning. We were supposed to have a public debate about this at IJCNN 2011 in San Jose. Walter posed the question directly to Rodrigo Quian Quiroga, who conducted many of these
experiments under the supervision of Itzhak Fried and Christof Koch. Walter also knew Rodrigo, having been co-authors or co-editors of a book. Rodrigo came through at the last minute before the public debate, acknowledging that the single cells in his studies
indeed had “meaning.”<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">“Meaning” and abstraction is at the heart of these debates, not grandmother cells. And finding “meaning” in activations of single cells directly contradicts the population coding hypothesis and supports instead the symbol system hypothesis.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Asim Roy<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Professor, Information Systems<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Arizona State University<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/lifeboat.com/ex/bios.asim.roy__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!NHg1P4byXZZmMFLMgr8A4dQNxSlqyvsqWef4wrPXtCXR0f0bo0eMm-rIF8G6ZV0$">Lifeboat Foundation Bios: Professor Asim Roy</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://isearch.asu.edu/profile/9973">Asim Roy | iSearch (asu.edu)</a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> KENTRIDGE, ROBERT W. <robert.kentridge@durham.ac.uk>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, August 21, 2026 10:14 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Asim Roy <ASIM.ROY@asu.edu>; Gary Marcus <gary.marcus@nyu.edu>; Stephen José Hanson <jose@rubic.rutgers.edu>; Hava Siegelmann (hava.siegelmann@gmail.com) <hava.siegelmann@gmail.com>; Juergen Schmidhuber <juergen.schmidhuber@kaust.edu.sa>; Ali Minai
<minaiaa@gmail.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> director@inc.ucsd.edu; connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Connectionists: FW: AI@50 videos...<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">I don’t think there is much I disagree with in Asim’s comment. I does go to show, though, how important the details of one’s definition of a grandmother cell is.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">If you take the hardline definition that a grandmother cell must respond to one concept and one concept alone, so that you can read off the presence of an ‘x’ from the response of a grandmother cell tuned to ‘x’s
then the Jennifer Aniston cell is not a grandmother cell.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">If you take Asim’s definition that they are cells which respond to a complex concept across a range of modalities etc., without any proviso that they must respond exclusively to ‘x’s then the Jennifer Aniston cell
is indeed a grandmother cell.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Reddy and Thorpe certainly describe an interesting class of cell, I’m just not sure if they correspond to Lettvin’s view.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">BTW, I talked to Charlie Gross about all this in the 1980s or 90s - I haven’t talked to him about this more recently so his views might have changed. I also knew Horace Barlow a bit, but my conversations with him
were about artificial neural nets and computation (again in the 80s and 90s), not neurophysiology. At the first talk I ever gave I notice Horace in the audience and shuddered - he was a bit terrifying to a young neophyte. He did ask a question at the end of
my talk, but it wasn’t one that stumped me, and he was very gracious about the whole thing.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">cheers,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Bob<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Sent from Outlook for Mac<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span style="color:black">From:
</span></b><span style="color:black">Asim Roy <</span><a href="mailto:ASIM.ROY@asu.edu">ASIM.ROY@asu.edu</a><span style="color:black">><br>
<b>Date: </b>Friday, 21 August 2026 at 05:16<br>
<b>To: </b>KENTRIDGE, ROBERT W. <</span><a href="mailto:robert.kentridge@durham.ac.uk">robert.kentridge@durham.ac.uk</a><span style="color:black">>; Gary Marcus <</span><a href="mailto:gary.marcus@nyu.edu">gary.marcus@nyu.edu</a><span style="color:black">>;
Stephen José Hanson <</span><a href="mailto:jose@rubic.rutgers.edu">jose@rubic.rutgers.edu</a><span style="color:black">>; Hava Siegelmann (</span><a href="mailto:hava.siegelmann@gmail.com">hava.siegelmann@gmail.com</a><span style="color:black">) <</span><a href="mailto:hava.siegelmann@gmail.com">hava.siegelmann@gmail.com</a><span style="color:black">>;
Juergen Schmidhuber <</span><a href="mailto:juergen.schmidhuber@kaust.edu.sa">juergen.schmidhuber@kaust.edu.sa</a><span style="color:black">>; Ali Minai <</span><a href="mailto:minaiaa@gmail.com">minaiaa@gmail.com</a><span style="color:black">><br>
<b>Cc: </b></span><a href="mailto:director@inc.ucsd.edu">director@inc.ucsd.edu</a><span style="color:black"> <</span><a href="mailto:director@inc.ucsd.edu">director@inc.ucsd.edu</a><span style="color:black">>;
</span><a href="mailto:connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu">connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu</a><span style="color:black"> <</span><a href="mailto:connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu">connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu</a><span style="color:black">><br>
<b>Subject: </b>RE: Connectionists: FW: AI@50 videos...<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black;background:#FFFECF">[EXTERNAL EMAIL]</span></b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Charlie Gross was in that discussion with Horace Barlow. So was Itzhak Fried and Christof Koch. The referenced Jennifer Aniston experiments were conducted under their guidance at UCLA. And so was Walter Freeman
and many other prominent neuro and cognitive scientists involved in that discussion.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Gross (2002) characterized grandmother cells as “multimodal.” Reddy and Thorpe (2014) also define concepts cells as “invariant, multimodal.” Thus, the fundamental characterization of these two concepts is
identical. “Multimodal invariance” implies associative learning across modalities. They also state that concept cells have “<b><i>meaning</i></b> of a given stimulus in a manner that is
<b><i>invariant</i></b> to different representations of that stimulus.” </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">“<b>Selectivity or specificity</b>,” “<b>complex concept</b>,” “<b>meaning</b>,” “<b>multimodal invariance</b>” and “<b>abstractness</b>” (Reddy and Thorpe, 2014) are all integral properties of both concept
cells and grandmother cells. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Reddy and Thorpe (2014) categorically state that “<b><i>abstract, invariant representations</i></b>” is “<i>a hallmark of MTL concept cells</i>.” Quiroga (2012) also admit that concept cells are abstract:
“<i>These and many other examples suggest that MTL neurons encode an <b>abstract</b></i> <b>representation</b> of the concept triggered by the stimulus.”</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Unfortunately, Barwich (2019) is completely flawed in its arguments against grandmother cells as argued in Roy’s commentary on the article (Roy (2020)).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">The neurophysiological evidence for purely abstract single cell representation in the brain points to symbolic representation in the brain.
<span style="color:black;background:white">Quiroga et al. (</span>2008<span style="color:black;background:white">) estimate that
<b>40% of MTL cells are abstract</b>. Thus, there is extensive use of abstractions at the single cell level in the brain. This is the neurophysiological evidence for the neurosymbolic approach and what Gary Marcus has been arguing for all along. In a way, both
approaches win and need each other.</span></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<ol style="margin-top:0in" start="1" type="1">
<li class="MsoNormal" style="mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Barlow H. B. (2009). Grandmother cells, symmetry, and invariance: how the term arose and what the facts suggest, in
<i>The Cognitive Neurosciences, 4th Edn.</i>, ed GazzanigaM. (Cambridge, MA: MIT Press), 309–320.</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Gross C. G. (2002). Genealogy of the “grandmother cell”.
<i>Neuroscientist</i>8, 512–518. 10.1016/j.meegid.2016.04.006</span><o:p></o:p></li></ol>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">3. Reddy L. Thorpe S. J. (2014). Concept cells through associative learning of high-level representations.
<i>Neuron</i>84, 248–251. 10.1016/j.neuron.2014.10.004</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">4. Barwich A-S (2019) The Value of Failure in Science: The Story of Grandmother Cells in Neuroscience. Front. Neurosci. 13:1121. doi: 10.3389/fnins.2019.01121</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">5. Roy A (2020) Commentary: The Value of Failure in Science: The Story of Grandmother Cells in Neuroscience. Front. Neurosci. 14:59. doi: 10.3389/fnins.2020.00059</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">6. Quiroga R. Q. Kreiman G. Koch C.FriedI. (2008). Sparse but not ‘grandmother-cell’ coding in the medial temporal lobe.
<i>Trends Cogn. Sci.</i>12, 87–91. 10.1016/j.tics.2007.12.003</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Asim Roy</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Professor, Information Systems</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Arizona State University</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/lifeboat.com/ex/bios.asim.roy__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!NHg1P4byXZZmMFLMgr8A4dQNxSlqyvsqWef4wrPXtCXR0f0bo0eMm-rIF8G6ZV0$"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Lifeboat Foundation Bios: Professor
Asim Roy</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://isearch.asu.edu/profile/9973"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Asim Roy | iSearch (asu.edu)</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> KENTRIDGE, ROBERT W. <</span><a href="mailto:robert.kentridge@durham.ac.uk"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">robert.kentridge@durham.ac.uk</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, August 20, 2026 3:53 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Asim Roy <</span><a href="mailto:ASIM.ROY@asu.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">ASIM.ROY@asu.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">>; Gary Marcus <</span><a href="mailto:gary.marcus@nyu.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">gary.marcus@nyu.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">>;
Stephen José Hanson <</span><a href="mailto:jose@rubic.rutgers.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">jose@rubic.rutgers.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">><br>
<b>Cc:</b> </span><a href="mailto:director@inc.ucsd.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">director@inc.ucsd.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">;
</span><a href="mailto:connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Connectionists: FW: AI@50 videos...</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">It is worth pointing out that in Jerry Lettvin’s original paper on the grandmother cell the concept was presented as a joke. Lettvin certainly believed in the notion that one might identify cells in the frog’s
brain as ‘bug detectors’, but he appeared to be sceptical about the idea that such cells might exist in the human brain representing complex concepts like ‘my grandmother’. There are a couple of great papers on the history of the grandmother cell:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Ann-Sophie Barwich (2019) The Value of Failure in Science: The Story of Grandmother Cells in Neuroscience. Front. Neurosci. 13:1121. doi: 10.3389/fnins.2019.01121</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Charles C Gross (2002) Genealogy of the "grandmother cell”. Neuroscientist 8(5):512-8. doi: 10.1177/107385802237175.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">I remember chatting to Charlie Gross about this around that time (he also reminisced about his part-time job mowing BF Skinner’s lawn).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">People often assume that the Quiroga et al (2005 Nature, 435. 1102 - 1107) paper on the Jennifer Aniston cell was positive evidence for the existence of grandmother cells in the human brain. This is far from the
truth. The Jennifer Aniston cell does not only respond to Jennifer Aniston, but also to related concepts like ‘Lisa Kudow’ (another actress in ‘Friends’), so activity in that cell does not uniquely code ‘Jennifer Aniston’ and cannot be used to read out the
presence of Jennifer Aniston. Quiroga et al make this clear in the discussion of their findings.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Bob Kentridge</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Psychology Department</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">University of Durham</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Canadian Institute for Advanced Research</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Programme on Brain, Mind and Consciousness</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:black">From: </span></b><span style="color:black">Connectionists <</span><a href="mailto:connectionists-bounces@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu">connectionists-bounces@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu</a><span style="color:black">> on
behalf of Asim Roy <</span><a href="mailto:ASIM.ROY@asu.edu">ASIM.ROY@asu.edu</a><span style="color:black">><br>
<b>Date: </b>Thursday, 20 August 2026 at 06:51<br>
<b>To: </b>Gary Marcus <</span><a href="mailto:gary.marcus@nyu.edu">gary.marcus@nyu.edu</a><span style="color:black">>; Stephen José Hanson <</span><a href="mailto:jose@rubic.rutgers.edu">jose@rubic.rutgers.edu</a><span style="color:black">><br>
<b>Cc: </b></span><a href="mailto:director@inc.ucsd.edu">director@inc.ucsd.edu</a><span style="color:black"> <</span><a href="mailto:director@inc.ucsd.edu">director@inc.ucsd.edu</a><span style="color:black">>;
</span><a href="mailto:connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu">connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu</a><span style="color:black"> <</span><a href="mailto:connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu">connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu</a><span style="color:black">><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: Connectionists: FW: AI@50 videos...</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black;background:#FFFECF">[EXTERNAL EMAIL]</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">The Horace Barlow note was after a furious private debate with some eminent neuro and cognitive scientists regarding Jennifer Aniston cells being evidence for grandmother cells. And this was at age 93 when he visited me after defending
his theory. At that stage of his career, his insights were profound.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Asim Roy</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Professor, Information Systems</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Arizona State University</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/lifeboat.com/ex/bios.asim.roy__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!NHg1P4byXZZmMFLMgr8A4dQNxSlqyvsqWef4wrPXtCXR0f0bo0eMm-rIF8G6ZV0$"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Lifeboat Foundation Bios: Professor
Asim Roy</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://isearch.asu.edu/profile/9973"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Asim Roy | iSearch (asu.edu)</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Asim Roy<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, August 19, 2026 6:28 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> 'Gary Marcus' <</span><a href="mailto:gary.marcus@nyu.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">gary.marcus@nyu.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">>; Stephen José Hanson <</span><a href="mailto:jose@rubic.rutgers.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">jose@rubic.rutgers.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">><br>
<b>Cc:</b> </span><a href="mailto:director@inc.ucsd.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">director@inc.ucsd.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">;
</span><a href="mailto:connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: Connectionists: FW: AI@50 videos...</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">I had some communication with Marvin Minsky and Jerry Fodor years ago. Here are two quotes from them:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">1. Marvin Minsky: "<span style="color:black;background:yellow">Don’t pay any attention to the critics. Don’t even ignore them</span>.” -By Sam Goldwyn</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">2. Jerry Fodor: “<span style="color:black;background:yellow">Arguing with Connectionists is like arguing with zombies; both are dead, but neither has noticed it</span>.”</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">And here’s a note from a neuroscience pioneer Horace Barlow, Darwin’s great-grandson (</span><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horace_Barlow"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Horace
Barlow - Wikipedia</span></a><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">), winner of many neuroscience prizes. Without his pioneering work poking into frog brains with microelectrodes, we would NOT have AI as we see it today. The grandmother cell theory
essentially points to where cognition exists in an abstract form. And there is plenty of neurophysiological evidence for such single cell abstractions, starting with line orientation cells.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#050505">======================================================================================================================================</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#050505">Dear Asim</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#050505">Yes, I would like to join your group, though I would (again) like to make it clear that the grandmother cell theory is not mine, though I still hold
that something conforming amazingly well to what was conceptualised by Jerry Lettvin 50 years ago, really does exist!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#050505">I am still actively interested in the topic, and have just sent off the final proofs of an essay bearing on it. I shall send you a copy of the final
proof as soon as I am allowed to circulate it, and of course the more widely discussed it is the better pleased I shall be, though I fear that
<span style="background:yellow">what I have written will not be universally accepted, at least at first</span>!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#050505">Best regards</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;color:#050505">Horace</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">=============================================================================================================</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Asim Roy</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Professor, Information Systems</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Arizona State University</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/lifeboat.com/ex/bios.asim.roy__;!!IKRxdwAv5BmarQ!NHg1P4byXZZmMFLMgr8A4dQNxSlqyvsqWef4wrPXtCXR0f0bo0eMm-rIF8G6ZV0$"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Lifeboat Foundation Bios: Professor
Asim Roy</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://isearch.asu.edu/profile/9973"><span style="font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">Asim Roy | iSearch (asu.edu)</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Connectionists <</span><a href="mailto:connectionists-bounces@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">connectionists-bounces@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Gary Marcus<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, August 19, 2026 11:23 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Stephen José Hanson <</span><a href="mailto:jose@rubic.rutgers.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">jose@rubic.rutgers.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">><br>
<b>Cc:</b> </span><a href="mailto:director@inc.ucsd.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">director@inc.ucsd.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">;
</span><a href="mailto:connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Connectionists: FW: AI@50 videos...</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">yep: neural networks ascended, pushed symbols out of the way, and then symbols came back relabeled as harnesses, loops code interpreters, and tools.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">neurosymbolic AI, the hybrid of the two approaches, clearly beat either of the two alternatives on their own.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">claude code, biggest recent advance, shows that pretty clearly, when you look under the hood.<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">gary<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Aug 19, 2026, at 10:16<span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"> </span>AM, Stephen José Hanson <<a href="mailto:jose@rubic.rutgers.edu">jose@rubic.rutgers.edu</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif"></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="wordsection1">Yes, historically this was an important meeting --and indeed the term AI was coined by John McCarthy who with several others put together the 1955 meeting; McCarthy also invented LISP after this meeting. Part of the AI meeting at
DM was political. McCarthy deliberately chose "Artificial Intelligence" partly to distance the new effort from Wiener's cybernetics and the neural network tradition. Which was thematic in the MACY meetings.. which ended in 1953--2 years before the "AI" meeting.
McCarthy wanted to stake out a separate field with a symbolic/logical emphasis (in contrast to McCulloch and Pitts). So the naming wasn't just descriptive; it was a bit of a territorial move that arguably sidelined neural networks for decades until the connectionist
revival in the 1980s (sorry Juergen). And the more recent revolution associated with DL and LLMs more specifically. In the 1970s, this fueled the long term debate in Cognitive Science on Symbols/Rules vs Vectors/NN. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="wordsection1">Well at least we know how that turned out.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="wordsection1">Stephen<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="wordsection1"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 8/17/26 13:30, Terry Sejnowski wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Jean-Marc -<br>
<br>
I was there and gave a talk, the only one on neural networks. I learned a lot from the other speakers.<br>
<br>
I just listened to the questions at the end of my talk. I pretty much predicted what was going to happen in AI and thought it would take 50 years. I was wrong, it took less than 20 years.<br>
<br>
One of the questions at the end was about intelligent aliens who appear and don't have human brains.<br>
This was a set piece in my recent book on ChatGPT and the Future of AI, where ChatGPT is the alien.<br>
<br>
I gave my version of that meeting in my first book on the Deep Learning Revolution. Every talk that reported progress did so because they had enough data to analyze, including Gene Charniak who was trying to parse sentences and Takeo Kanade working on computer
vision (These two talks are not included in the list). At the end Marvin Minsky accused them for just working on applications, not real AI.<br>
<br>
Terry<br>
<br>
------<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 8/17/2026 9:18 AM, Fellous, Jean-Marc wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">In case you did not see this: Some amazing lectures and (now historical) perspectives… the most interesting parts are when they tried and predicted the future of AI!<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Connectionists
</span><a href="mailto:connectionists-bounces@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><connectionists-bounces@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu></span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
<b>On Behalf Of </b>George Cybenko<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, August 17, 2026 6:00 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> </span><a href="mailto:connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">connectionists@mailman.srv.cs.cmu.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Connectionists: AI@50 videos...</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">In 2006, we held a 50th anniversary conference at Dartmouth to commemorate<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">the historic 1956 meeting that coined the term "artificial intelligence." At that time,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">five of the surviving original participants attended. Today they are all gone.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">I just recently posted videos of the talks from the AI@50 meeting at<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/sites.dartmouth.edu/cybenko/dartmouth-ai50-videos/__;!!Mih3wA!HX5M154b9l4fIHZdxakK00FZ4H1IPqVHrV_pC-lh-4XwoZ6CvDp7SyXZ-ObDk5oWYIct3ux47KDlf3KvyIoMq7VLCwxY0JhC$">https://sites.dartmouth.edu/cybenko/dartmouth-ai50-videos/</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">INobody foresaw what is happening in AI today and in fact,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">there were several digs against neural networks etc. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Enjoy!<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Regards<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">George Cybenko<o:p></o:p></p>
<pre>-- <o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><span style="font-size:7.5pt">George Cybenko, Dorothy and Walter Gramm Professor of Engineering<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="font-size:7.5pt">Dartmouth College, 8000 Cummings Hall, Hanover NH 03755 USA<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="font-size:7.5pt"> <o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="font-size:7.5pt">email: </span><a href="mailto:gvc@dartmouth.edu" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:7.5pt">gvc@dartmouth.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:7.5pt"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="font-size:7.5pt">FAX: 603 646-9024<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="font-size:7.5pt">Cell: 603 369-1133<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style="font-size:7.5pt">Assistant: <span style="color:black">Ellen Wirta, 603 646-9672, </span></span><a href="mailto:Ellen.K.Wirta@Dartmouth.edu"><span style="font-size:7.5pt">Ellen.K.Wirta@Dartmouth.edu</span></a><span style="font-size:7.5pt"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
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