<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">Dear Steve,</span><br class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">Thanks for your gracious note, but </span><b class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">the passage I objected to was not one line but several</b><span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">, (eg “I wish people would stop taking [Marcus] so seriously”), and, critically, Hinton’s fabrication regarding machine translation was not an innocent mistake. People misrepresent me all the time, but in this case</span><b class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> I had already specifically advised Hinton in private that what he said was misrepresenting me on this exact point.</b><span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=""> </span><br class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">Moreover, the bullying campaign</span><b class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> goes back several years</b><span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">. For example, moments before I gave a 2019 talk to an audience of computer scientists in Toronto, Hinton replied-all to the invite, in an effort to persuade the audience not to go. As it happens, his email didn’t get through to the list but I was cc’d (possibly inadvertently) and did receive it; the bullying intent was quite apparent. </span><br class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">If AIHub believed in its charter, and wished to elevate the discourse, it would take down the entire passage and not support a persistent campaign to misrepresent and stifle a critical voice. By all means, if Hinton wants to write a reasoned critique of my work, publish it. But as one eminent computer scientist wrote to me yesterday, “cronyism, collusion and now bullying and dehumanizing critics … should not be rewarded by this community.”</span><br class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">Thank you for allowing me to clarify. And yes, I will read the rest of the interview with interest, and of course I’d love to get your thoughts about how the ‘hybrid movie” might end, but I’ll put that in a separate thread :)</span><br class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="">Cheers.</span><br class="" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><div>Gary</div><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Feb 3, 2022, at 5:10 AM, Stephen José Hanson <<a href="mailto:jose@rubic.rutgers.edu" class="">jose@rubic.rutgers.edu</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class="">
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<font size="+1" face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" class="">Since AIHUB was
the one who posted the recent discussion between myself and Geoff,
I suppose that could be the proximate causal event.</font><font size="+1" class=""><br class="">
<font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" class="">But in looking over the
transcript, I think you are overreacting to the single en
passant comment in an hour about you. Hardly, a "personal
attack". </font><br class="">
<br class="">
<font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" class="">Moreover, I've known you
for over 30 years, and frankly it does sound like something you
might have said );-) And I agree your positions in various
books and articles have evolved over time. But I and AIHUB
are always happy to correct transcripts that have seriously
miss-represented someone's claims. </font><br class="">
<br class="">
<font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" class="">I would encourage you to
read the whole transcript, as you will see the discussion does
intersect with a number of issues </font><font face="Helvetica,
Arial, sans-serif" class="">you raised in an earlier post on what is
learned/represented in DLs.</font><br class="">
</font><p class=""><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" class=""><font size="+1" class="">Its
important for those paying attention to this thread, to
realize these are still very early times. Many more shoes
will drop in the next few years. I for one don't believe one
of those shoes will be Hybrid approaches to AI, I've seen
that movie before and it didn't end well. <br class="">
</font></font></p><p class=""><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" class=""><font size="+1" class="">Best
and hope you are doing well.</font></font></p><p class=""><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif" class=""><font size="+1" class="">Steve<br class="">
</font> </font></p><p class=""><br class="">
</p><p class=""><br class="">
</p><p class=""><br class="">
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2/2/22 9:52 PM, Gary Marcus wrote:<br class="">
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<blockquote type="cite" cite="mid:E420133E-AEB8-4CBB-B464-CF75E6CD2661@nyu.edu" class="">
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<div dir="ltr" class="">Dear Geoff,
<div dir="ltr" class=""><br class="">
<div class="">Causality is often hard to establish, but I didn't start
this thread; I merely responded to a false assertion of
yours that was publicized at the top.</div>
<br class="">
<div class="">More broadly, it's a shame for the field that you won't
engage in the real issues at hand, even with a clear
home-court advantage.</div>
<br class="">
<div class="">Gary</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<blockquote type="cite" class=""><br class="">
</blockquote>
<blockquote type="cite" class="">On Feb 2, 2022, at 12:52, Geoffrey
Hinton <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:geoffrey.hinton@gmail.com"><geoffrey.hinton@gmail.com></a> wrote:<br class="">
<br class="">
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<div dir="ltr" class="">
<div dir="ltr" class="">You started this thread and it was a mistake
for me to engage in arguing with you. I have said all I
want to say. You have endless time for arguing and I
don't. I find it more productive to spend time writing
programs to see what works and what doesn't. You should
try it sometime.
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Geoff</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
</div>
<br class="">
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