| Date: 2014-01-25 12:09 AM | From: james bower | | Having spent almost 30 years building realistic models of its cells | and networks (and also doing experiments, as described in the | article I linked to) we have made some small progress - but only by | avoiding abstractions and paying attention to the details. Jim, I think it's disingenuous to claim that *any* model can avoid abstractions, and in particular that your type of "realistic" multicompartmental single-cell and network modelling could ever do so. *Real* morphologically complex cells are embedded in complex networks, which are embedded in complex organisms, which are embedded in complex environments, which are embedded in complex ecosystems. Evolution acts on the net result of *all* of this, indirectly via a process of development. Certain species thrive in certain ecosystems if their proteins, cells, networks, nervous systems, bodies, and communities allow them to function in that environment well enough to reproduce. The details of *all* of these things matter. Are all of these details represented realistically in your models? No, and they shouldn't be -- you pose questions that can be addressed by the things you do include, abstract away the rest, and all is well and good. But other different yet no less realistic models are built to address different questions, paying attention to different sets of details (such as large-scale development and plasticity, for my own models), and again abstract away the rest. I am happy to join with you to decry truly unrealistic models, which would be those that respect none of the details at any level. Down with unrealistic models! But there is no meaningful sense in which any model can be claimed to avoid abstraction, and no level that exclusively owns biological realism. Jim Bednar ________________________________________________ Dr. James A. Bednar Director, Doctoral Training Centre in Neuroinformatics and Computational Neuroscience University of Edinburgh School of Informatics 10 Crichton Street, Edinburgh, EH8 9AB UK http://anc.ed.ac.uk/dtc http://homepages.inf.ed.ac.uk/jbednar ________________________________________________ -- The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in Scotland, with registration number SC005336.