<p dir="ltr">Hey, I am happy when our taxpayer money, of which I contribute way more than I get back, funds any science in all branches of the government. </p>
<p dir="ltr">Neuromorphic and brain-like computing is on the rise ... Let's please not shoot ourselves in the foot with in-fighting!!</p>
<p dir="ltr">Thanks,<br>
Ralph's Android</p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Jan 24, 2014 4:13 PM, "Juyang Weng" <<a href="mailto:weng@cse.msu.edu">weng@cse.msu.edu</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
Yes, Gary, you are correct politically, not to upset the "emperor"
since he is always right and he never falls behind the literature.
<br>
<br>
But then no clear message can ever get across. Falling behind the
literature is still the fact. More, the entire research community
that does brain research falls behind badly the literature of
necessary disciplines. The current U.S. infrastructure of this
research community does not fit at all the brain subject it
studies! This is not a joking matter. We need to wake up, please.
<br>
<br>
Azriel Rosenfeld criticized the entire computer vision filed in his
invited talk at CVPR during early 1980s: "just doing business as
usual" and "more or less the same" . However, the entire computer
vision field still has not woken up after 30 years! As another
example, I respect your colleague Terry Sejnowski, but I must openly
say that I object to his "we need more data" as the key message for
the U.S. BRAIN Project. This is another example of "just doing
business as usual" and so everybody will not be against you. <br>
<br>
Several major disciplines are closely related to the brain, but the
scientific community is still very much fragmented, not willing to
wake up. Some of our government officials only say superficial
worlds like "Big Data" because we like to hear. This cost is too
high for our taxpayers. <br>
<br>
-John <br>
<br>
<div>On 1/24/14 2:19 PM, Gary Cottrell
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
Hi John -
<div><br>
</div>
<div>It's great that you have an over-arching theory, but if you
want people to read it, it would be better not to disrespect
people in your emails. You say you respect Matthew, but then you
accuse him of falling behind in the literature because he hasn't
read your book. Politeness (and modesty!) will get you much
farther than the tone you have taken.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>g.</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Jan 24, 2014, at 6:27 PM, Juyang Weng <<a href="mailto:weng@cse.msu.edu" target="_blank">weng@cse.msu.edu</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> Dear Matthew:<br>
<br>
My apology if my words are direct, so that people with
short attention spans can quickly get my points. I do
respect you.<br>
<br>
You wrote: "to build hardware that works in a more
brain-like way than conventional computers do. This is
not what is usually meant by research in neural networks."<br>
<br>
Your statement is absolutely not true. Your term
"brain-like way" is as old as "brain-like computing".
Read about the 14 neurocomputers built by 1988 in Robert
Hecht-Nielsen, "Neurocomputing: picking the human brain",
IEEE Spectrum 25(3), March 1988, pp. 36-41. Hardware will
not solve the fundamental problems of the current human
severe lack in understanding the brain, no matter how many
computers are linked together. Neither will the current
"Big Data" fanfare from NSF in U.S.. The IBM's brain
project has similar fundamental flaws and the IBM team
lacks key experts. <br>
<br>
Some of the NSF managers have been turning blind eyes to
breakthrough work on brain modeling for over a decade, but
they want to waste more taxpayer's money into its "Big
Data" fanfare and other "try again" fanfares. It is a
scientific shame for NSF in a developed country like U.S.
to do that shameful politics without real science, causing
another large developing country like China to also echo
"Big Data". "Big Data" was called "Large Data", well
known in Pattern Recognition for many years. Stop playing
shameful politics in science! <br>
<br>
You wrote: "Nobody is claiming a `brain-scale theory that
bridges the wide gap,' or even close." <br>
<br>
To say that, you have not read the book: <a href="http://www.brain-mind-institute.org/press.html" target="_blank">Natural
and Artificial Intelligence</a>. You are falling behind
the literature so bad as some of our NSF project
managers. With their lack of knowledge, they did not
understand that the "bridge" was in print on their desks
and in the literature. <br>
<br>
-John<br>
<br>
<div>On 1/23/14 6:15 PM, Matthew
Cook wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">Dear John,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I think all of us on this list are interested in
brain-like computing, so I don't understand your
negativity on the topic.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Many of the speakers are involved in efforts to
build hardware that works in a more brain-like way
than conventional computers do. This is not what is
usually meant by research in neural networks. I
suspect the phrase "brain-like computing" is intended
as an umbrella term that can cover all of these
efforts.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I think you are reading far more into the
announcement than is there. Nobody is claiming a
"brain-scale theory that bridges the wide gap," or
even close. To the contrary, the announcement is very
cautious, saying that intense research is "gradually
increasing our understanding" and "beginning to shed
light on the human brain". In other words, the
research advances slowly, and we are at the beginning.
There is certainly no claim that any of the speakers
has finished the job.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Similarly, the announcement refers to "successful
demonstration of some of the underlying principles [of
the brain] in software and hardware", which implicitly
acknowledges that we do not have all the principles.
There is nothing like a claim that anyone has enough
principles to "explain highly integrated brain
functions".</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>You are concerned that this workshop will avoid the
essential issue of the wide gap between neuron-like
computing and highly integrated brain functions. What
makes you think it will avoid this? We are all
interested in filling this gap, and the speakers
(well, the ones who I know) all either work on this,
or work on supporting people who work on this, or
both.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>This looks like it will be a very nice workshop,
with talks from leaders in the field on a variety of
topics, and I wish I were able to attend it.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Matthew</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Jan 23, 2014, at 7:08 PM, Juyang Weng wrote:</div>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> Dear
Anders,<br>
<br>
Interesting topic about the brain! But
Brain-Like Computing is misleading because
neural networks have been around for at least 70
years.<br>
<br>
I quote: "We are now approaching the point when
our knowledge will enable successful
demonstrations of some of the underlying
principles in software and hardware, i.e.
brain-like computing."<br>
<br>
What are the underlying principles? I am
concerned that projects like "Brain-Like
Computing" avoid essential issues: <br>
the wide gap between neuron-like computing and
well-known highly integrated brain functions.<br>
Continuing this avoidance would again create bad
names for "brain-like computing", just such
behaviors did for "neural networks".<br>
<br>
Henry Markram criticized IBM's brain project
which does miss essential brain principles, but
has he published such principles?<br>
Modeling individual neurons more and more
precisely will explain highly integrated brain
functions? From what I know, definitely not,
by far. <br>
<br>
Has any of your 10 speakers published any
brain-scale theory that bridges the wide gap?
Are you aware of any such published theories? <br>
<br>
I am sorry for giving a CC to the list, but many
on the list said that they like to hear
discussions instead of just event announcements.
<br>
<br>
-John<br>
<br>
<br>
<div>On 1/13/14 12:14
PM, Anders Lansner wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<h1 style="background:white"><span lang="EN">Workshop
on Brain-Like Computing, February 5-6
2014<u></u><u></u></span></h1>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-size:10.0pt" lang="EN">The
exciting prospects of developing
brain-like information processing is one
of the Deans Forum focus areas.<br>
As a means to encourage progress in this
research area a Workshop is arranged
February 5th-6th 2014 on KTH campus in
Stockholm. <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-size:10.0pt" lang="EN">The
human brain excels over contemporary
computers and robots in processing
real-time unstructured information and
uncertain data as well as in controlling
a complex mechanical platform with
multiple degrees of freedom like the
human body. Intense experimental
research complemented by computational
and informatics efforts are gradually
increasing our understanding of
underlying processes and mechanisms in
small animal and mammalian brains and
are beginning to shed light on the human
brain. We are now approaching the point
when our knowledge will enable
successful demonstrations of some of the
underlying principles in software and
hardware, i.e. brain-like computing.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span style="font-size:10.0pt" lang="EN">This
workshop assembles experts, from the
partners and also other leading names in
the field, to provide an overview of the
state-of-the-art in theoretical,
software, and hardware aspects of
brain-like computing.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<h2 style="background:white"><span lang="EN">List
of speakers<u></u><u></u></span></h2>
<table style="width:303.0pt;border-collapse:collapse" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="404">
<tbody>
<tr style="height:15.75pt">
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><strong><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Speaker</span></strong><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><strong><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">Affiliation</span></strong><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr style="height:15.75pt">
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Giacomo
Indiveri</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">ETH
Zürich</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr style="height:15.75pt">
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Abigail
Morrison</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Forschungszentrum
Jülich</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr style="height:15.75pt">
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Mark
Ritter</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">IBM
Watson Research Center</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr style="height:15.75pt">
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Guillermo
Cecchi</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">IBM
Watson Research Center</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr style="height:15.75pt">
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Anders
Lansner</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt" lang="EN-US">KTH Royal Institute
of Technology</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt" lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr style="height:15.75pt">
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Ahmed
Hemani</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt" lang="EN-US">KTH Royal Institute
of Technology</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt" lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr style="height:15.75pt">
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Steve
Furber</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">University
of Manchester</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr style="height:15.75pt">
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Kazuyuki
Aihara</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">University
of Tokyo</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr style="height:15.75pt">
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Karlheinz
Meier</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Heidelberg
University</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
<tr style="height:15.75pt">
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Andreas
Schierwagen</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
<td style="padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;height:15.75pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Leipzig
University</span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><strong><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"" lang="EN">For signing up to the
Workshop please use the registration
form found at <u><a href="http://bit.ly/1dkuBgR" target="_blank"><span style="font-weight:normal">http://bit.ly/1dkuBgR</span></a><u></u><u></u></u></span></strong></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><strong><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-weight:normal" lang="EN">You need to sign up before
January 28<sup>th</sup>.<u></u><u></u></span></strong></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><strong><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";font-weight:normal" lang="EN">Web page: <a href="http://www.kth.se/en/om/internationellt/university-networks/deans-forum/workshop-on-brain-like-computing-1.442038" target="_blank">http://www.kth.se/en/om/internationellt/university-networks/deans-forum/workshop-on-brain-like-computing-1.442038</a>
</span></strong><b><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">******************************************<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Anders Lansner<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Professor in Computer
Science, Computational biology<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">School of Computer Science
and Communication<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Stockholm University and
Royal Institute of Technology (KTH)<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><a href="mailto:ala@kth.se" target="_blank"><span style="color:blue">ala@kth.se</span></a>,
<a href="tel:%2B46-70-2166122" value="+46702166122" target="_blank">+46-70-2166122</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<br>
<br>
<hr style="border:none;color:#909090;background-color:#b0b0b0;min-height:1px;width:99%">
<table style="border-collapse:collapse;border:none">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style="border:none;padding:0px 15px 0px 8px"> <a href="http://www.avast.com/" target="_blank"> <img src="http://static.avast.com/emails/avast-mail-stamp.png" border="0"> </a> </td>
<td>
<p style="color:#3d4d5a;font-family:"Calibri","Verdana","Arial","Helvetica";font-size:12pt"> Detta
epostmeddelande innehåller inget
virus eller annan skadlig kod för <a href="http://www.avast.com/" target="_blank">avast!
Antivirus</a> är aktivt. </p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<pre cols="72">--
--
Juyang (John) Weng, Professor
Department of Computer Science and Engineering
MSU Cognitive Science Program and MSU Neuroscience Program
428 S Shaw Ln Rm 3115
Michigan State University
East Lansing, MI 48824 USA
Tel: <a href="tel:517-353-4388" value="+15173534388" target="_blank">517-353-4388</a>
Fax: <a href="tel:517-432-1061" value="+15174321061" target="_blank">517-432-1061</a>
Email: <a href="mailto:weng@cse.msu.edu" target="_blank">weng@cse.msu.edu</a>
URL: <a href="http://www.cse.msu.edu/%7Eweng/" target="_blank">http://www.cse.msu.edu/~weng/</a>
----------------------------------------------
</pre>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
<pre cols="72">--
--
Juyang (John) Weng, Professor
Department of Computer Science and Engineering
MSU Cognitive Science Program and MSU Neuroscience Program
428 S Shaw Ln Rm 3115
Michigan State University
East Lansing, MI 48824 USA
Tel: <a href="tel:517-353-4388" value="+15173534388" target="_blank">517-353-4388</a>
Fax: <a href="tel:517-432-1061" value="+15174321061" target="_blank">517-432-1061</a>
Email: <a href="mailto:weng@cse.msu.edu" target="_blank">weng@cse.msu.edu</a>
URL: <a href="http://www.cse.msu.edu/%7Eweng/" target="_blank">http://www.cse.msu.edu/~weng/</a>
----------------------------------------------
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</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
<div>
<div>
<div>[I am in Dijon, France on sabbatical this year. To call
me, Skype works best (gwcottrell), or dial <a href="tel:%2B33%20788319271" value="+33788319271" target="_blank">+33 788319271</a>]</div>
<div style="word-wrap:break-word"><br>
</div>
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">Gary Cottrell
<a href="tel:858-534-6640" value="+18585346640" target="_blank">858-534-6640</a> FAX: <a href="tel:858-534-7029" value="+18585347029" target="_blank">858-534-7029</a></div>
<div style="word-wrap:break-word"><br>
</div>
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">My schedule is
here: <a href="http://tinyurl.com/b7gxpwo" target="_blank">http://tinyurl.com/b7gxpwo</a></div>
<div style="word-wrap:break-word"><br>
Computer Science and Engineering 0404</div>
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">IF USING FED EX
INCLUDE THE FOLLOWING LINE: <br>
CSE Building, Room 4130<br>
University of California San Diego<br>
9500 Gilman Drive # 0404<br>
La Jolla, Ca. 92093-0404<br>
<span style="font-family:'Book Antiqua';font-size:1.2em;font-style:oblique"><br>
</span></div>
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">Things may come
to those who wait, but only the things left by those who
hustle. <span style="font-family:'Book Antiqua';font-size:1.2em;font-style:oblique">-- Abraham
Lincoln</span></div>
<div style="word-wrap:break-word"><br>
</div>
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">"Of course, none
of this will be easy. If it was, we would already
know everything there was about how the brain works, and
presumably my life would be simpler here. It could
explain all kinds of things that go on in Washington."
-Barack Obama</div>
<div style="word-wrap:break-word"><br>
</div>
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">"Probably once or
twice a week we are sitting at dinner and Richard says,
'The cortex is hopeless,' and I say, 'That's why I work on
the worm.'" Dr. Bargmann said.<br>
<br>
"A grapefruit is a lemon that saw an opportunity and took
advantage of it." - note written on a door in Amsterdam on
Lijnbaansgracht.<br>
<br>
"Physical reality is great, but it has a lousy search
function." -Matt Tong<br>
<br>
"Only connect!" -E.M. Forster<br>
<br>
"You always have to believe that tomorrow you might write
the matlab program that solves everything - otherwise you
never will." -Geoff Hinton</div>
<div style="word-wrap:break-word"><br>
</div>
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">"There is nothing
objective about objective functions" - Jay McClelland<br>
<br>
"I am awaiting the day when people remember the fact that
discovery does not work by deciding what you want and then
discovering it."<br>
-David Mermin<br>
<br>
Email: <a href="mailto:gary@ucsd.edu" target="_blank">gary@ucsd.edu</a><br>
Home page: <a href="http://www-cse.ucsd.edu/%7Egary/" target="_blank">http://www-cse.ucsd.edu/~gary/</a></div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
<pre cols="72">--
--
Juyang (John) Weng, Professor
Department of Computer Science and Engineering
MSU Cognitive Science Program and MSU Neuroscience Program
428 S Shaw Ln Rm 3115
Michigan State University
East Lansing, MI 48824 USA
Tel: <a href="tel:517-353-4388" value="+15173534388" target="_blank">517-353-4388</a>
Fax: <a href="tel:517-432-1061" value="+15174321061" target="_blank">517-432-1061</a>
Email: <a href="mailto:weng@cse.msu.edu" target="_blank">weng@cse.msu.edu</a>
URL: <a href="http://www.cse.msu.edu/~weng/" target="_blank">http://www.cse.msu.edu/~weng/</a>
----------------------------------------------
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</div>
</blockquote></div>